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Headlines Chechnya - maskhadov is dead

RageAgainst

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#1

dustinzgirl

Banned - What an Asshat!
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#2
It is a state fighting against its country. I dont think that it should be its own republic, because it never truly was. On the other hand, I think that they need to stop killing fucking children to prove a point.
 

RageAgainst

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#3
dustinzgirl said:
It is a state fighting against its country. I dont think that it should be its own republic, because it never truly was. On the other hand, I think that they need to stop killing fucking children to prove a point.
Actually, chechnya was conquered by russian czars in the 19th century, becamed an autonomous republic in 1921, but was annexed to USSR by stalin during the second world war. In 1991 when the USSR collapsed, chechnya proclaimed its independance but moscow never recognized it. Instead Russia sent thousands and thousands of troops into the province and the violence got bad.

at least half the people of chechnya are separatists.. But the caucasus region is full of oil... draw your own conclusions.
 

DanGeo23

Resident Conservative
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the country might fall into deeper violence.
if he was truely a moderate voice then it sux cause now the extremeists might take over and there will be more Belsan school sieges... ohh BTW its not a country.. I say let them have it... pull all Russian military personnel/equipment and bases out... but I would make them sign treaties that wouldn't allow the siezure of property or buisnesses that belong to someone else...
But the caucasus region is full of oil... draw your own conclusions.
I'd rather not ... but its obvious you did (draw your own conclusion)... in 2003 Chechnya produced .6% of Russias oil...
that would be like Illinois trying to secede from the US and the US saying no... then using oil as a reason...
 

gurlgonewild

Was machen Sie?
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it baffles me why people the world over are obsessed w/ gaining their independence from their mother country soley to strengthen their identity-nationality/race (whatever you'd like to call it). i mean, so what if most of the population of an area consists of one nationality? its a small minority compared to the rest of the country. why is this still so important to people? can't we all just get along? wtf! i understand atrosities commited against minoirities, or something along those lines is what causes such agitation most of the time but just the same, it's like they're all stuck in ancient times.

this is the disconnect for me, being an american. i read stuff like this and think it's all bulshit.
many lives could've been saved if not for all the wars waged in the name of sovereignty.

yes, i realize if it weren't for our own liberation we would be europeans too, but that was then and this is now. after so many years of a wide variety of ethnicities coming together in one country, when it works so well...i think the world should be sincere and give it a real try rather than taking it to the death.
 
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#6
There was a talk-show where a 10 year old Chechnyan boy in my country said his dream is to go to his homecounty and fight those russians there. Their urge to freedom is understandable, and now that their Leader Mashadov' s down, there' ll be more guerilla war and terror attacks. I support Chechnyans and wish that Russian policy would change by European and other Western countries boycotting the 9-th of may celebrations in Moscow.
 

RageAgainst

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#7
DanGeo23 said:
ohh BTW its not a country..
Yeah I know that, my bad

DanGeo23 said:
I'd rather not ... but its obvious you did (draw your own conclusion)... in 2003 Chechnya produced .6% of Russias oil...
that would be like Illinois trying to secede from the US and the US saying no... then using oil as a reason...
I'm not questionning this number at all, but the fact is geologists say up to 200 billion barrels lay beneath the caspian region. Due to political instability however, it's perfectly logical that only 0.6% of Russias oil is extracted from the region. A pipeline pumping 100,000 barrels of crude a day to the black sea has also been closed in 2000 due to the violence context. For moscow, Chechnya needs to stay with Russia not only for their self-esteem and to save face but also because the oil potential of the region is probably the highest in the world after the middle east, according to geologists.

Russian soldiers have often raped and killed civilians during their mobilization in Chechnya while rebels and extremists have blown up subway stations and killed innocent civilians as well in Russia. Maskhadov was for a "war" against Russian troops but only within Chechnya's borders.

gurlgonewild said:
it baffles me why people the world over are obsessed w/ gaining their independence from their mother country soley to strengthen their identity-nationality/race (whatever you'd like to call it). i mean, so what if most of the population of an area consists of one nationality? its a small minority compared to the rest of the country. why is this still so important to people? can't we all just get along? wtf! i understand atrosities commited against minoirities, or something along those lines is what causes such agitation most of the time but just the same, it's like they're all stuck in ancient times.
I think you're wrong. Russia isn't their mother country, they don't have the same religion, they don't speak the same langage ; even worst, there's not a single school in chechnya that teaches in the chechen majority language. It's like the US claiming Mexico to be a U.S.A. state, and then forcing them to learn english through the education system.
 

DanGeo23

Resident Conservative
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It's like the US claiming Mexico to be a U.S.A. state, and then forcing them to learn english through the education system.
¿Mexico isn't a state? huh...
Russian soldiers have often raped and killed civilians during their mobilization in Chechnya
they're just playing by the UN playbook...
 

RetArt

A Rampant Vagitarian
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#10
Í can´t see the situation getting any better... Black Widows and such will keep committing suicide attacks until, and possibly even after they have gained complete independency.. Which is quite far away.
Oil. Black gold makes the world go round. shit happens.

For a personal note.
When Finland was under russian empire the schools in here were forced to teach russia. Finland was partially autonomic so they still could have their "normal" teaching in their native tongue.. The thing was nobody really wanted to learn russia, so often there was one or two students who had relatives there, or had learnt it from home or smth. So when the "inspector" came to see if they could speak russia as it was ordered, these few kids were told to display their russia skills..
It gets a little trickier when the whole eaching SHOULD be done in russia. I´m quessing that the teachers there are for the independency too, so i think theyll teach in their natrive tongue as often as possible.
 

RageAgainst

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#11
RetArt said:
Í can´t see the situation getting any better... Black Widows and such will keep committing suicide attacks until, and possibly even after they have gained complete independency.. Which is quite far away.
Oil. Black gold makes the world go round. shit happens.
Ah yes, you're probably the only one here who knows anything about the black widows... Cause they just don't talk about them in any medias over here.. In my international politics class we discussed chechnya and the black widows....It's sad and scary. I have to feel for them even though it's a very touchy subject. For those who don't know, black widows are women who lost their sons, husbands, and sometimes everyone and everything, to the Russian troops. Having nothing left and fueled by hatred they blow themselves up along with either Russian soldiers or civilians. An eye for an eye, so to speak. Very violent... But I can't judge them, I never experienced the hatred that comes with losing your whole family to military troops.
 

gurlgonewild

Was machen Sie?
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#12
Russia paid $10M bounty on Chechen rebel leader

Russia paid bounty on Chechen rebel leader
By Reuters Tuesday March 15, 2005 11:35am

Russia said on Tuesday it had paid millions of dollars to reward the people who helped it find and kill Chechen rebel leader Aslan Maskhadov, as an outcry grew over Moscow’s refusal to return his body for burial.
Maskhadov was killed a week ago in what troops said was a targeted raid, but Russian and foreign media raised questions over the manner of the veteran rebel’s death and activists have slammed the decision to bury him in an unmarked grave.

The former Soviet army colonel’s half-naked corpse has been shown repeatedly on television and critics say Russia’s failure to treat him with dignity in defeat threatens to radicalise Chechen rebels further.

The Federal Security Service (FSB), successor to the Soviet-era KGB, said it had received a tip-off from citizens responding to a $10 million bounty on the leaders of the Chechen separatist movement in September 2004.

“This helped us establish the precise location of the international terrorist and band leader of the Chechen republic Aslan Maskhadov and conduct a special operation,” an FSB spokesman said.

Maskhadov led resistance to Moscow’s rule in Chechnya for a decade and his killing was a notable success for Russian forces.

But analysts say the relative moderate’s death could open the way for extremists to take full control of separatist forces. And activists say the decision to invoke Russia’s anti-terrorism law and refuse to give his body for burial by relatives, who have already appealed for its return, is a violation of human rights.

“It is also pointless, and will help the radicalisation of the opposition. This law is to stop the grave becoming a place of pilgrimage ... but for the rebels he will be a martyr anyway, so it is not really important where his body is.”
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/93045be8-954f-11d9-bc72-00000e2511c8.html

now there's a country who knows how to get shit done! let's pay the mafia $10M to wack this guy for us-and then we'll take the credit for it. /i'm being sarcastic/ (the whole article insinuates they posed his body for pics that aired over the tv plus there's speculation as to how his death came about.)

I think you're wrong. Russia isn't their mother country, they don't have the same religion, they don't speak the same langage ; even worst, there's not a single school in chechnya that teaches in the chechen majority language. It's like the US claiming Mexico to be a U.S.A. state, and then forcing them to learn english through the education system.
rage,

if you recall history, most of the western USA was apart of Mexico at one time and all of those differences (religion, language, the USA not being their mother country, etc) existed. fast forward 200 years later, and oh look, it does work if you want it to. my point was, it is possible to work out any differences. not that i cannot understand the wish to seek sovereignty.
 

MaxPower

You're my number two
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#13
dustinzgirl said:
It is a state fighting against its country. I dont think that it should be its own republic, because it never truly was. On the other hand, I think that they need to stop killing fucking children to prove a point.

Cough..cough..... brittish colonies in North America, should have just been happy the way they were as well?