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Fringe Is 'God' Morally Corrupt?

Ropel

Some random Guy
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#1
Ok soooo...taking from the average monotheistic definition of 'God', we find a few common beliefs...
:rolleyes: 'God' created the universe.
:speechless: 'God' is all powerful.
:flamed: 'God' will condemn you to fire & brimstone or the equivelant
if you don't play nice.
Okay so...God creates you and your 'Soul' (and if He didn't, he could change them...or is he not all powerful?) and sets the Earth in motion and indirectly creates all events (though he COULD change them.) Suppose there are two men. One had a rough childhood, (God's fault) and was taught the morals of greed and screwing other people over before they screw you. Then the other had a comftorable childhood (also 'God's fault) and was taught goodness and to be a little kiss-up.
Now, when they die...the man 'God' caused to be morally corrupt (as we see it) goes to eternal punishment. And the other one, get eternal paradise (even though eternity is a paradox...don't argue).
Now is this really the just, kind, 'God' that is pictured in most religions?! Cause if it is...:confused: I hope I'm on his good side.
 

tw33k

Theoretical Realist
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#2
So your point is everything is God's fault. Maybe it's the other way around. You're put on this Earth to do your best, love your fellow man, and endure life's hardships. In my opinion religion has little to do with God, it's more about man manipulating God's image to conform to his narrow view of what's right or wrong. Did God make man in his image or did man try to fit God into his limited knowledge? God is an old man with white hair and beard in flowing robes looking down from on high? Of course that's a comical view of an almighty being. Some Chinese believe in Chi, an all inclusive energy that flows through all things. I think Hindus call it Prana. Kind of like "The Force" in Star Wars. It's an ancient concept, and one I think is more accurate than a judgemental, vengeful old man watching over us, deciding arbitrarily on our fate.
 

Ropel

Some random Guy
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#3
Energy

:confused: I think I heard something about that...some Feng Shui stuff, and I must agree-- It does seem more likely...
 

Darklight

Oppressing your posts...
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#4
and your point is? this is the vital fabric of the church.... god brought you into this world, left you to fend for yourself, and if you get out of line, will take you out... not unlike a drunken deadbeat dad..
 
R

RedOctober

Guest
#8
"God is a concept, by which we measure our pain."

John Lennon said that, and I think it's true.

It's man's imagination, that makes it impossible to live in the world like it is.
Without love, hope and understanding. That's why we have to believe in something, that is better than we are ourselves.

But there isn't. We are alone on a lonely planet in some outback star system in space. All we can do is cooperate, that every man, woman and child in this world has a life worth living. Without hate, war, poverty, injustice and all other crimes of today.
Injustice I said! Who are we to take a life for a life!
Because there is the problem allright!

We have some people in the past who have inspired many generations after they lived. One man was St. Nicolas. Yes, from him Santaclaus was derived.
One remarkable thing St. Nicolas did, was that he used force to throw away the sword of the executioner, who was going to cut the head of 3 young men, who did a wrong.
In that way he thought us, we should not repay wrong with wrong.
But as long as a people has pleasure in the taking of a man's life, whatever he did in his own life, there can be no future for such a people.

They live in a real hell. :god:
 

UberSkippy

a.k.a. FuckTheBullShit
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#9
Go read Blameless in Abadon by James Morrow. It's the second book in a trilog, the first being Towing Jehova.

Towing Jehova: God dies, falls to Earth and an oil tanker is hired to tow him to an ice berg to keep him frozen.

Blameless in Abadon: Got isn't dead, he's on life support and is put on trial for crimes against humanity.

The third is... well if i tell you what it's about it gives away some things in the other two. But all in all it's a good series.
 

AzH

Blame Fait (I always do)
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#10
I posted something along these lines back in August 2004:

Let us consider the evidence against the 'Good of God'.

1) He knew that Jesus would be killed, that he would suffer an excrutiating death at the hands of men, but he sent him anyway. Some say, this is a sacrifice. That God gave his Son to us so he could die for our sins. Others (mostly me) say, scrap that, why would a Father be so cruel as to send his Son to a certain painful death? Because God knew Jesus would be murdered and did not prevent it, even though he could, he becomes an accessory to the murder of his own Son.

2) Without mercy, he obliterated the entire poulation of the Earth except for two lucky souls (does anyone know the name of Noah's wife?). This included, children, babies, and the unborn. What did these young people do to deserve to be killed so ruthlessly? Anything? Did they sin? Does the baby in the womb have the ability to commit sin let alone understand what is and isn't a sin? No, it does not. Irregardless, God (in a glorious show of compassion) killed them all. Excellent work, Lord. We can add Planetary Genocide to the list of your crimes.

3) God is a jealous God. He wants you to worship him and him alone. When you worship another he gets jealous and wants the worshippers that your God has. Nay, he doesn;t just want them, the covets them. He breaks one of his won Commandments by doing so. This makes God a hypocrite. Whereas we cannot class hypocrisy as a crime per se, we can expect him to be true to the 'Nation of God'. He turned his back on one of his nation's laws, making him a traitor to his people. Add treason to the list of crimes.

4) The tree. The tree is an interesting thing. God creates Adam & Eve (Eve from one of Adam's ribs, no less. Yes, I know it's stretching the realms of fantasy a littel too far, but please, Ladies and Gentlemen, stay with me for this one). God tells his newly created children that they cannot touch the tree. They can do anything else they wish. Anything but touch the tree. Now, every parent knows (so one can safely assume that an omnipotent parent would) that if you tell a child not to touch something, they will. 'Don't touch that damn tree, you little tykes.' They do. Of course. Now, this isn't a crime, but it is gross stupidity. Especially when the omnipotence of God would suggest he would know it was going to happen anyway. Does anybody else see the utter thick-headedness on display from this 'Great and Powerful Creator of All Things'?

To summarise, the case against God:

1) His actions lead to the murder of his Son.
2) Genocide on a global scale.
3) Hypocrisy and treason against his people.
4) Utter stupidity.

Is this a being worthy of our praise? You decide.
 

leehype

drunk with a jeep problem
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#11
My belife gose like this, I lead a decent life, I know the difference between right and wrong. Some one who leads a bad life, still knows the difference between right and wrong. If you act on your knolidge of right and wrong, you are good, and vice versa. Can you blame someone for steeling food to keep there kids alive, no, what if they were steeling food cause they spent all there money buying a 500000 house and a 100000 car. This right here is why I hate getting into dissusuons about god.
 

DirtyBird

Divides by Zero
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#13
God can sure help the Patriots win the super bowl, but when it comes to starving Ethiopians, they're just SOL...
 
#14
screw_ball said:
There is no God.

your right, there is no god, but, there is, however, a life force, an essence of something bigger than ourselves, a chi, and can be manipulated by those enlightened enough to know how, and those spiritually strong enough to endure it's effects.
 
R

RedOctober

Guest
#18
I agree God is an image created by man. It's typical that while I'm writing this, our youngest cat is sitting near the Christmas tree, and trying to nick some balls off the tree, if I don't look.

It's almost as if I am God, telling the fucking cat can do anything, except touch the apples on the tree in the Garden of Eden.
So I took a little waterpistol to scare the cat away from the tree, but he knows the bloody thing after a short while.
I can raise my voice, but only during the day, if I do it now, I get my battleaxe coming down the stairs, so I keep quiet. :happysad:

It's just like telling people how to behave, and the most difficult of all.. Your own children. So that's why you invent a story to teach them something.
But they will know what you're after, and you're degraded into and old grumpy father that has old fashioned ideas.

You can say time and time again that traffic is dangerous, but the only way they learn to really take care of themselves is when they see one of their own buddies in a wheelchair after a serious accident, blinded for the rest of his life.

So I'll take you back to the time we were hunter gatherers..
You had a great time as a father, because you could show your kids what a wild boar would do with a man's leg. It was easy to show them the scars.
If man lives in a natural background, you can simply show what's life all about.

That changed quite dramatically when the first farmers arrived, and with it the explosion in numbers of people that came with it.
The first cities didn't have a natural reference, so the first bogey man was created. Listen my boy, otherwise a nightmare will tear your heart out while yoú're asleep. And the Aztecs and Maya's had rituals to show that to their people. Make them FEAR and RULE.

That's also the God of the Old Testament. A jealous bastard.
I want you to believe only me.
If not, I'll cut your balls off.
I think that must be the silent message behind circumcision. :sword:

In the Roman culture, which inherited a lot from the Greeks, it was not done to alter the human body, so the God became a more spiritual one.
A God you could ask something.
The view we have about God as an old man with a white beard is a direct replica of Zeus or Jupiter (Jove).

Het is even coming to us in the reincarnation of Santaclaus.

In Northern Europe it's easy to understand, the Christian church just put a Christian picture on older Gods. The only difference is, Chriatians take their God serious, and the ancient people just used him as a figure in their myths.

See you in valhalla! :hviking:
 
#20
I wonder about one of the very first lessons in the bible..Cain kills Able..Ables blood cries out from the earth..God says to Cain where is thy brother...Cain says oh what now am I my brothers keeper..

The answer is of course you are..

The story of the apple and the tree of knowledge..that debate still goes on to this day..who's fault it was and it turns into an excuse to push women into a subordinate role..

The answer is nobody wants to accept the full blame for their actions..

God deals out punishment to everyone involved..The message is that people need to accept responsibility for the things they do, and not blame others for "peer pressure". And that in a sense what goes around comes around...alot like karma.

While it is true that people can be influenced one big lesson is that everyone needs to stop blaming everyone else for their own shortcommings, and do what's right even when times get hard and you can't go wrong. Hard times don't last forever even though at the time they seem insurmountable, but they do pass.

Yeah I believe that Jesus is the messiah, but I also see that in every part of the world most people believe in a higher power or force of sorts. Makes me think we are wired into some sort of knowledge that everyone is connected in some way..Really every person is the same..we all want the same basic things..love and comfort..we all feel pain and grief..everyone knows tradgedy. It is all things we cannot see, but we all know is there..and if your an atheist more power to you..freewill is what it is.