Headlines OK, so tell me...

Finch

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Ok, I've often wondered why communism is sometimes referred to as the route of all evil. Why would countries bother conforming to communist ideals if it were so evil? So please tell me, from preferably an American point of view, what is so bad about communism? and I'm betting you can't come up with an argument that rectifies the vietnam war.
 

Icarus

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There's nothing wrong with communism. There's something wrong with the excuse for communism that was in practice for a while.

You challenge us to tell you what's so bad... I challenge you to provide us with a pure, working example of communism. You can't. The reason why is numbers, of course. Communism wouldn't work in a group larger than 300, at the most. 100 is way more realistic. And we simply can't do that.

So, to answer your question, communism is referred to as the root of all evil because, where it's been implemented, it has led to evil. That's not the fault of communism, though, it's the fault of individuals.
 

tzedek

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i would like to point out that a true communist system has never been truley acheived.


communism: A classless society with no exploitation. No state machine used by one section of the population to oppress another section. No need for professional armies or police forces. No use of production for profit or exchange. Society runs in accord with the principle: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
 

voiceofreason

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Finch said:
Ok, I've often wondered why communism is sometimes referred to as the route of all evil. Why would countries bother conforming to communist ideals if it were so evil? So please tell me, from preferably an American point of view, what is so bad about communism? and I'm betting you can't come up with an argument that rectifies the vietnam war.
Ummm, I think Money is the Root of all evil. Never heard that about communism.


Anyway, there is nothing wrong with communism, it is a really cool "idea". Unfortunately, it goes against human nature, survival of the fittest, and all that. It has never succeded, nor will it ever in it's true form.
 

mariusthegreat

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correction...woman are the root of all evil..

Woman = Time * Money

We all know that time is money...

time = money
woman = money * money

woman = (money)^2

We also know that money is the root of all evil,
correct?

money = sqrt(evil)

woman = [sqrt(evil)]^2

Hence,

woman = evil
 

Fugly

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Communism in itself is not a bad thing. If it worked then it would be ideal. The problem is that it does not represent the human condition. People like to have ambition... some reason to work hard. Communism takes that away. If everyone is equal how do you excel at something? But the biggest problem is that the people at the top of the foodchain in communist nations become tyrants because they have ALL the power. Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely. If you turn people into worker bees for to long it stops working unless you put fear into them. People sould not have to fear the government its not the way it should work. But in EVERY single case of Communist countrys the only way the Government lasts is by subjagating its populace through force and fear. That is bad.

The vietnam war had nothing to do with opposing communism per se....it was sold to the public by the dominoe effect theory. If one state falls to communism then they all will (hence dominoe). Americans feared russia because they were the only Gov't that could oppose us bullet for nulet man to man. In vietnam we were basically fighting the russians...there are numerous accounts fo dogfights with "round eye" NVA pilots flying MIG 21's. It was a proving ground...a test war you could say. USA lost 58,000 soldiers from 1959-1975. Over 3 million vietnamese were killed on both sides. We learned that jungle warfare is a bitch...and the Rusisians learned that we would not stand by and let them take over the world. And in the end we out spent the russians, something a capatilist society is without peer at. Oh and by the way we technically one that war because the NVA surrendered and signed the Paris treaty....but they broke it an invaded s.vietnam again later.

Did I justify it no...but how can you justify anywar? People are just puppets to a government...but in the American government wars are fought to better the populace...in communism its used to keep the heads of state in power.
 

johnny kuntz

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what about china? its constantly reforming, growing and expanding..

For centuries China stood as a leading civilization, outpacing the rest of the world in the arts and sciences. But in the 19th and early 20th centuries, China was beset by civil unrest, major famines, military defeats, and foreign occupation. After World War II, the Communists under MAO Zedong established a dictatorship that, while ensuring China's sovereignty, imposed strict controls over everyday life and cost the lives of tens of millions of people.

After 1978, his successor DENG Xiaoping gradually introduced market-oriented reforms and decentralized economic decision making. Output quadrupled by 2000. Political controls remain tight while economic controls continue to be relaxed.
I think china could be an succesful communist system in the future, maybe ten years from now.
 

johnny kuntz

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France and Germany have been pushing hardest for closer ties with China, hoping to cash in on a lucrative market but also to develop a strategic alliance as a counterweight to American power after the diplomatic trauma of the Iraq war.

Last June, the French defence minister, Michele Alliot-Marie, proposed sharing sensitive military technology with Beijing. She called for a softening of the arms embargo imposed on the country after the Tiananmen Square massacre in 1989.

The Chinese already have the world's second biggest defence budget, £40 million annually, but they have to rely on outdated weaponry bought from Russia and Ukraine.

Yesterday's white paper said the ever-closer military ties rendered the EU embargo a relic from the last century.
soon, they are gonna buy real weapons. :thumbsup:
 

Signify

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Fugly said:
Communism in itself is not a bad thing. If it worked then it would be ideal. The problem is that it does not represent the human condition. People like to have ambition... some reason to work hard. Communism takes that away. If everyone is equal how do you excel at something? But the biggest problem is that the people at the top of the foodchain in communist nations become tyrants because they have ALL the power. Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely. If you turn people into worker bees for to long it stops working unless you put fear into them. People sould not have to fear the government its not the way it should work. But in EVERY single case of Communist countrys the only way the Government lasts is by subjagating its populace through force and fear. That is bad.

The vietnam war had nothing to do with opposing communism per se....it was sold to the public by the dominoe effect theory. If one state falls to communism then they all will (hence dominoe). Americans feared russia because they were the only Gov't that could oppose us bullet for nulet man to man. In vietnam we were basically fighting the russians...there are numerous accounts fo dogfights with "round eye" NVA pilots flying MIG 21's. It was a proving ground...a test war you could say. USA lost 58,000 soldiers from 1959-1975. Over 3 million vietnamese were killed on both sides. We learned that jungle warfare is a bitch...and the Rusisians learned that we would not stand by and let them take over the world. And in the end we out spent the russians, something a capatilist society is without peer at. Oh and by the way we technically one that war because the NVA surrendered and signed the Paris treaty....but they broke it an invaded s.vietnam again later.

Did I justify it no...but how can you justify anywar? People are just puppets to a government...but in the American government wars are fought to better the populace...in communism its used to keep the heads of state in power.



is a war being fought way the fuck over across bettering the populace?
 

dustinzgirl

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tzedek said:
i would like to point out that a true communist system has never been truley acheived.


communism: A classless society with no exploitation. No state machine used by one section of the population to oppress another section. No need for professional armies or police forces. No use of production for profit or exchange. Society runs in accord with the principle: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

This is true. communism was a great Ideal led by terrible people. I actually prefer communism and unitarism over democracy, however, we have yet to find a soul pure enough that could rule a communist or unitarist society without prejudice, dictatorship and thirst for ultimate power.

Oh, welll I guess that is true of democracy too.
 

Icarus

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Well... in communism... there wouldn't (technically) be any rulers...

Johnny... I'll beleive it when I see it. China also has a lot of problems (not like every other country doesn't, mind you)...
 

voiceofreason

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johnny kuntz said:
what about china? its constantly reforming, growing and expanding..


I think china could be an succesful communist system in the future, maybe ten years from now.
Mao would turn over in his grave if he saw what China looked like today. It gets more capitalistic all the time...
 

johnny kuntz

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voiceofreason said:
Mao would turn over in his grave if he saw what China looked like today. It gets more capitalistic all the time...
I gues your right, its not true communism anymore..









btw:
you know whats funny? getting bad rep for giving an opinion. :p thanks nobody! :thumbsup:

OK, so tell me... 09-27-2004 12:17 AM you'd be wrong
 

MaxPower

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Some people are bias. If they don't like you they'll give you bad rep every chance they geht.
Don't sweat it.